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worzlee Gate Opener
Joined: 02 Jan 2010 Odometer: 16 Location: sheffield uk
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Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:19 pm Post subject: what 4x4s can tow 3500kg?
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Hi all does anyone know what 4x4s can tow 3500kg other than land rover defenders and discoverys? I'm looking to spend between 3-4k and not sure what to buy.
Cheers lee.
__________________________________ one wife - leave it ! |
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scrunt Articulating
Joined: 11 Jul 2012 Odometer: 985 Location: Tayside.
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RichardD Marshall
Joined: 13 Mar 2003 Odometer: 22856 Location: State of Confusion
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Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:30 pm Post subject:
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For that kind of cash, on road use/family wagon, I'd plump for an older Jap but be very careful which one you buy!
I think the list is not exhaustive
Mitsubishi Shoguns/Pajero - none! max 3300kg, most sub 2700kg
Landcruisers - some!
Jeep Grand Cherokee (only)
VW Toureg - some
After looking up what I thought were obvious choices I've realised that some 'proper' 4x4s have measly towing capacity
Chalk up another score for LR products! All Defenders, Discos and Rangies have 3500kg capacity (okay some are listed at 3493, and some at 3501!)
__________________________________ Poking the Grim Reaper with a stick then running away. The devil made me do it but God said it was okay with him. |
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dxmedia Mud Obsessed
Joined: 10 Dec 2008 Odometer: 2185
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Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:41 pm Post subject:
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Isuzu trooper LWB MK2 >
Landcruiser - big ones
Patrol LWB
Ssanyong Rexton (I wouldn't)
Fourtrak!!!
Grand Cherokee WJ onwards
Landrovers (you've mentioned)
Porsche Cayanne
VW Toureg IIRC
Mercedes ML
There's probably a few more.
There's only one on that list I'd tow day in and out at max load with, and that's the Landcruiser 4.2 VX
X5's are rated at about 2 tonne IIRC
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RichardD Marshall
Joined: 13 Mar 2003 Odometer: 22856 Location: State of Confusion
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Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:47 pm Post subject:
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dxmedia wrote: | Isuzu trooper LWB MK2 >
Landcruiser - big ones
Patrol LWB
Ssanyong Rexton (I wouldn't)
Fourtrak!!!
Grand Cherokee WJ onwards
Landrovers (you've mentioned)
Porsche Cayanne
VW Toureg IIRC
Mercedes ML
There's probably a few more.
There's only one on that list I'd tow day in and out at max load with, and that's the Landcruiser 4.2 VX
X5's are rated at about 2 tonne IIRC |
It varies by engine size and fuel type - only SOME of the models above have 3500kg capacity. You have to check very carefully before you buy.
ETA
If towing capacity is top priority I'd still look at older Jap over LR. My 110 is a great tow vehicle so long as you are patient
__________________________________ Poking the Grim Reaper with a stick then running away. The devil made me do it but God said it was okay with him. |
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dxmedia Mud Obsessed
Joined: 10 Dec 2008 Odometer: 2185
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Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:50 pm Post subject:
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Yes, but quite a few of those above are all engines across the range.
For sake of argument the 2.8 LWB patrol is 3.5 (used to have one)
The 2.7 ML is also.
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RichardD Marshall
Joined: 13 Mar 2003 Odometer: 22856 Location: State of Confusion
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Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:15 pm Post subject:
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dxmedia wrote: | Yes, but quite a few of those above are all engines across the range.
For sake of argument the 2.8 LWB patrol is 3.5 (used to have one)
The 2.7 ML is also. |
Yep.
What amazes me though is how some that I thought would be a shoe-in for 3500kg aren't.
Add in a budget of £4k max and older Jap models become the best bet.
__________________________________ Poking the Grim Reaper with a stick then running away. The devil made me do it but God said it was okay with him. |
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w3526602 Difflock Royalty
Joined: 10 Jun 2002 Odometer: 10758 Location: Glynneath, South Wales
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Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:29 pm Post subject:
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Hi,
Just in case ..... you can't tow anything like 3500kg if you only a a Cat.B licence. In fact a Cat.B driving a Disco can only pull about 850kg.
Must it be a 4x4? Transit sized vans can pull a lot .... and some of those are 4x4. Do an Ebay search for Volkswagen SYNCRO, thats the 4x4 Transporter, although same name includes some VW cars.
Some Jap grey imports MAY not have any towing allowance at all, depending on what the VIN plate says..
602
__________________________________ Don't force it, use a bigger hammer, cos if it doesn't fit, the hammer is not big enough. |
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scrunt Articulating
Joined: 11 Jul 2012 Odometer: 985 Location: Tayside.
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Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 4:12 pm Post subject:
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For absent friends lets mention. 'Ssanyong',
ok, so it needs to be a Rexton maybe and its maybe out of budget,
but 'Ssangyong'
3500kg or even 3504 kg
george
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w3526602 Difflock Royalty
Joined: 10 Jun 2002 Odometer: 10758 Location: Glynneath, South Wales
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Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:44 am Post subject:
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but 'Ssangyong' 3500kg or even 3504 kg
Hi,
3504kg? That's a strange figure.
3500kg MGW is OK on over-run brakes. But 3501kg MGW will require inter-linked brakes (EG - air brakes). adding about £10,000 to the price of the tow-car. OK, there are cheaper ways, but I'm not aware of any that have Tyre Approval. I believe new trailers now require TA ... it was scheduled for introduction in 2012, but I didn't hear a fanfare of trumpets.
All the big Land Rovers can tow 4000kg, but only if they have inter-linked brakes, so 3500kg MGW is the practical limit.
Its the MCW that is stamped onto the trailer "VIN" plate that counts, not its ALW.
602
__________________________________ Don't force it, use a bigger hammer, cos if it doesn't fit, the hammer is not big enough. |
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scrunt Articulating
Joined: 11 Jul 2012 Odometer: 985 Location: Tayside.
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Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:45 am Post subject:
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No idea,
i just took it from the towing information and they are classing it as suitable for towing 'Showman Caravans'.
Given as,
SsangYong Rexton TD290, Kerb Weight 1898 Kg
Towing Capacity 3504Kg/ 7724Lbs
(also RX 320S & RX 320 Auto)
Maybe typos, error or just how it is.
4 Kg would be the difference between my light lunch being carried in the caravan or eaten and in my tummy.
george
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w3526602 Difflock Royalty
Joined: 10 Jun 2002 Odometer: 10758 Location: Glynneath, South Wales
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Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:14 pm Post subject:
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i just took it from the towing information and they are classing it as suitable for towing 'Showman Caravans'.
Hi, I suppose they have enough "bling" to match the caravans.
Showmen have special concessions .... I think they are permitted to tow two trailers if one of them is a living van. But I visulise that as being a Heavy Tractor (doubling as a generator) towing a merry-go-round, towing a living van. OK, the merry-go-round probably has air brakes, but I don't know about the caravan. Maybe it doesn't need brakes .... same as a farm trailer. ???
Showmen also have special Planning concessions for their caravans, which they call Winter Quarters, or something like that.
602
__________________________________ Don't force it, use a bigger hammer, cos if it doesn't fit, the hammer is not big enough. |
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worzlee Gate Opener
Joined: 02 Jan 2010 Odometer: 16 Location: sheffield uk
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Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:07 pm Post subject:
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Thanks for all responses,
What i'm actually after is a family runanround that is also capable of towing a braked trailer 3500kg max gross weight, unladen weight 800kg, i will be using the trailer to carry a Discovery which is approx 2200kg. This means the gross weight will be approx 3000kg. Anything capable of towing over 3000kg would be ideal.
__________________________________ one wife - leave it ! |
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sus Just got MTs
Joined: 03 Nov 2011 Odometer: 247 Location: norfolk
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Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:39 pm Post subject:
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ive had quite a few big 4x4's and the best tow car imho is a vw touareg 3.0tdi it towed a dream, disco 3 2.7tdi was also good but the vw was better
__________________________________ 99 (T) 300tdi disco 50th anna
2'' lift 265/75/16 BF Goodridge MT's
camel cut,de-cat,EGR blank |
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clbarclay Off-Road Guru
Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Odometer: 1779 Location: Worcesterhire
1987 Land Rover Range Rover
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Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 10:02 pm Post subject:
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On that budget I would have a good look at 80 series land cruisers. Our 4.2 TD auto cost under 4K and is a nice tow car, seats up to 8 adults in reasonable comfort is a very practical vehicle. Notable down sides are the handling of heavy live axles on road (suspect tired suspension bushes) and only 25mpg. Unlike many other vehicles though the mpg is pretty constant. Towing 3.5 tons or 130 km/h with a roof box doesn't hinder it much.
If you don't need to tow the full 3500kg, then I would also look at a lwb Mitsubishi Shoguns, I haven't tried one personally, but know a few people (as in face to face know, not friend of a friend on the internet) who have them and been very positive about them and appear to be better value than the 80 series.
__________________________________ The Lord helps them as helps them selves
and the Lord help them caught helping there selves. |
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dxmedia Mud Obsessed
Joined: 10 Dec 2008 Odometer: 2185
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Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:17 pm Post subject:
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What about the 100 series. Ifs so more stable than the 80 and can be found for that price.
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scotty wong Just got MTs
Joined: 22 Nov 2008 Odometer: 472 Location: kent
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 9:41 am Post subject:
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We tow two horses with a ml and its great.the size and weight really helps keep things under control we have used a few others disco rangey terracan but a 100 sieries land crusier is the only one i found that was better.
Scotty
__________________________________ if the truth can be told so as to understood it will be believed. jeep xj |
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waveydave Mud Obsessed
Joined: 10 Jan 2006 Odometer: 2740 Location: waveyvillie oop norf
1994 Land Rover Discovery
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 11:24 am Post subject:
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http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Leyland-DAF-FA-4X4-DI...sh=item27ca616595
Should handle 3500kgs with out any issues
To be honest the best tow vehicle I know would be a 110. There rated at far higher than 3500 kg (i think they can go right up to 7.5tonne gross train weight but youd have to check) if there tachoed and have air brake aux hook up fitted. It's just UK law that prevents them taking any more with out a properly braked trailer.
What does your drivers licence allow you to tow? Many people get caught out with that one.
__________________________________ OUCH |
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Xpajun Mud Obsessed
Joined: 22 Sep 2008 Odometer: 3245
1988 Mitsubishi Shogun
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 11:32 am Post subject:
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w3526602 wrote: | Hi,
Some Jap grey imports MAY not have any towing allowance at all, depending on what the VIN plate says..
602 |
Jap grey imports have a GTW rather than a GVW and GTW plated - my Pajero has a GTW of 4.9 tonne IIRC so providing the vehicle weight is kept below 1.4 tonne it can tow 3.5 tonne
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mudplugga Mud Obsessed
Joined: 23 Oct 2004 Odometer: 2798 Location: Shropshire mostly, and Mid Wales
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 10:00 pm Post subject:
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waveydave wrote: | http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Leyland-DAF-FA-4X4-DIESEL-10-TON-DROP-SIDE-TRUCK-/170899105173?pt=UK_Commercial_Trucks&hash=item27ca616595
Should handle 3500kgs with out any issues
To be honest the best tow vehicle I know would be a 110. There rated at far higher than 3500 kg (i think they can go right up to 7.5tonne gross train weight but youd have to check) if there tachoed and have air brake aux hook up fitted. It's just UK law that prevents them taking any more with out a properly braked trailer.
What does your drivers licence allow you to tow? Many people get caught out with that one. |
I had 110's at work for many years, three of them, and we towed mobile pumps and generators a lot. The generators were specially made for the company I worked for with smaller fuel tanks to keep them within the legal towing limit if they were fueled up. They were a bloody nightmare behind the 110's, my mate tipped one on its side when he braked with mud under the nearside wheels. And we all had horror stories, in the end we refused to tow at the limit.
At the same time I had a LWB Fourtrack Indy, and I towed at the max' a couple of times with that and it was way more stable, the 110's were battleships in a storm, the Indy was stable. It's just a pity the brakes were *****!
But I towed my trialer for years behind the Indy on a 4 wheel Brian James trailer and that was excellent, but nowhere near the max limit.
__________________________________ http://www.ipernity.com/home/294337
"Roof, doors, wheels. It's the way I drive." |
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jamie_grieve Articulating
Joined: 19 Aug 2009 Odometer: 876 Location: South Scotland
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 11:58 pm Post subject:
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I have to say I never found the 110's to be a good tow vehicle either. The hitch is too far behind the back wheels and there is just too much movement in everything to be stable.
A 3 - 4K Landy would also have a lot of rust in the chassis which seriously weakens them. A Jap chassis can tolerate quite a lot of surface rust without being compromised. 2.1mm of mild steel as used in Landy chassis and rear cross members doesn't have much left to give at max train weight.
Toyotas have a great name and are very stable but the 4.2 lump really is a bit of a plug and even the slightest incline has them on their knees.
Something common rail with lots of boost getting good mpg most of the time but the power when you need it would be the modern take.
I could be wrong since I've been out of the UK for so long but I understand it is what your trailer is plated at which determines what can tow it.
For example it would be illegal to tow a 16 foot Ifor Williams trailer plated at 3.5 tons with a Hilux. I don't know what law or article would be contravened here or if the trailer was old and unplated. This comes from some local farmers being pulled recently by VOSA looking for red diesel. Jap pickups and 3.5 ton trailers being fairly common round here.
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mudplugga Mud Obsessed
Joined: 23 Oct 2004 Odometer: 2798 Location: Shropshire mostly, and Mid Wales
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Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 12:23 am Post subject:
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In Wales a couple of years ago the Police were hauling in farmers on the way to a livestock market who were towing large trailers behind pickups, and if they were overloaded they made them finish their journey right there. It was a planned operation and they had rented a field and had the RSPCA on hand to supervise the unloading of animals.
Around here, Telford, the favorite Police pastime is rounding up the pickups towing mini diggers on trailers.
It's something most Police forces are very aware of and are very active in Policing.
I agree about the overhang on 110's, and I also think the high chassis and low drop plate has a negative effect, when they had these 4 wheeled big generators on the back they would see-saw the back of the 110 up and down and lift the rear axle of the 110 under braking, there would be smoke coming off the rear tyres under moderate braking. If you were turning a corner and you had to brake the jacknife was instant. It was no fun at all. And the generators were perfectly balanced, two men could push them about on a flat car park. I towed one on a site with a full laden Transit without any problem, but it would have been illegal on the road.
__________________________________ http://www.ipernity.com/home/294337
"Roof, doors, wheels. It's the way I drive." |
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Nathaniel Difflock Royalty
Joined: 13 May 2003 Odometer: 17901 Location: North, North Yorkshire
1979 Suzuki LJ
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 8:08 am Post subject:
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Transit twin wheel pickup is the most stable tow vehicle you can get.
Shame the most any are plated to tow is 3000kgs.
Kia Sorento mk2 can tow 3000kgs too.
__________________________________ Nat
If You Open Your Mind Too Much Your Brain Will Fall Out |
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TullyK Just got MTs
Joined: 09 Aug 2011 Odometer: 189 Location: Cornwall
1996 Daihatsu Sportrak
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 6:03 pm Post subject:
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jamie_grieve wrote: | A Jap chassis can tolerate quite a lot of surface rust without being compromised. 2.1mm of mild steel as used in Landy chassis and rear cross members doesn't have much left to give at max train weight.
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2.1mm!! That seems crazy, my Sportrak chassis must be at least that thick and that can only tow 1500kg. Although that must be largely due to the engine
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jamie_grieve Articulating
Joined: 19 Aug 2009 Odometer: 876 Location: South Scotland
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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 6:19 pm Post subject:
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Tow limits are to do with brake surface area, being able to move off on a steep gradient and a bunch of other stuff I'd like to know too.
2.1mm, sorry, my mistake. The metal used is 14swg which is actually 2.03mm when I checked. The depth and construction is where the strength comes from. It is mild steel, not a carbon steel like others so it also rusts more readily.
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