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weldingscotty803 Just got MTs
Joined: 28 Apr 2010 Odometer: 275 Location: chesterfield
1996 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:11 am Post subject:
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that'll be a no then?!? ah well. Keeps you busy for 10 minutes
__________________________________ I thought i could see the light, then i noticed i had arc eye! |
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Toseland Mud Obsessed
Joined: 25 Oct 2011 Odometer: 3209 Location: cardiff
1999 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:33 pm Post subject:
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rockwatt wrote: | weldingscotty803 wrote: | Could you fit them ally plates in the lathe ok or did you have to machine them on the miller? |
The clue is in the pic's ! It's a big lathe that would take 16" diameter. |
yeah but did you use a lathe to do those?
__________________________________ I live by 2 sayings:
1. The beatings will continue until morale improves
2. Pain is just Weakness leaving the body..
The feeling you get when you first smash your shaft out, is one you will never forget.. especially if you do it in front of 10 guys. |
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Xpajun Mud Obsessed
Joined: 22 Sep 2008 Odometer: 3245
1988 Mitsubishi Shogun
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 7:04 pm Post subject:
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rockwatt wrote: | weldingscotty803 wrote: | Could you fit them ally plates in the lathe ok or did you have to machine them on the miller? |
The clue is in the pic's ! It's a big lathe that would take 16" diameter. |
The factory I did my training in had a Wilson lathe - not big - about a 40' bed and perhaps a 12" centre height but it did have a gap which allowed me to turn and bore a 27" diameter 12' thick piece of steel, in fact not just one but three, it was a long job, difficult, especially truing the block in the first place.
Never saw anything like the lathe at the time or since - well worth having one.
Anyway I would say doing those plates on the mill with a rotary table like that would be far quicker than using a lathe
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 8:57 pm Post subject:
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Xpajun wrote: |
The factory I did my training in had a Wilson lathe - not big - about a 40' bed and perhaps a 12" centre height but it did have a gap which allowed me to turn and bore a 27" diameter 12' thick piece of steel, in fact not just one but three, it was a long job, difficult, especially truing the block in the first place.
Never saw anything like the lathe at the time or since - well worth having one.
Anyway I would say doing those plates on the mill with a rotary table like that would be far quicker than using a lathe |
I wish I had a gap bed lathe ! Err wait a minute I have pmsl
I can get 17" in the gap and if I use the face plate it will do 6" thick
But like you say it's only one rotation on the miller so much quicker and then just chuck a drill bit in and plot the DRO and drill all 5 in one shot.
So between the mill, lathe with rear mounted slotting head and an array of rotary tables and indexers there's not much I can't do.
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
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weldingscotty803 Just got MTs
Joined: 28 Apr 2010 Odometer: 275 Location: chesterfield
1996 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:02 pm Post subject:
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i'm liking that carpet of swarf
__________________________________ I thought i could see the light, then i noticed i had arc eye! |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:13 pm Post subject:
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weldingscotty803 wrote: | i'm liking that carpet of swarf |
Look behind the mill to the left and there is a mag sweeper ! But all the swarf on the floor is bloody alloy ain't it
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
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weldingscotty803 Just got MTs
Joined: 28 Apr 2010 Odometer: 275 Location: chesterfield
1996 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:16 pm Post subject:
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give the kids some gloves and tell them to clean it up. get it bagged up and weighed in.
__________________________________ I thought i could see the light, then i noticed i had arc eye! |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:38 pm Post subject:
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weldingscotty803 wrote: | give the kids some gloves and tell them to clean it up. get it bagged up and weighed in. |
Gloves ??????
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
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weldingscotty803 Just got MTs
Joined: 28 Apr 2010 Odometer: 275 Location: chesterfield
1996 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:42 pm Post subject:
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all i can say is 'cruel'
anyway, lets see some more pictures of what you've been up to. or have you been busy with something else wink wink
__________________________________ I thought i could see the light, then i noticed i had arc eye! |
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Toseland Mud Obsessed
Joined: 25 Oct 2011 Odometer: 3209 Location: cardiff
1999 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:25 pm Post subject:
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having swarf splinters sticking all over your hands is a right of passage.. almost as important as the first pint at 18...
__________________________________ I live by 2 sayings:
1. The beatings will continue until morale improves
2. Pain is just Weakness leaving the body..
The feeling you get when you first smash your shaft out, is one you will never forget.. especially if you do it in front of 10 guys. |
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offroad 68 Winch Assistant
Joined: 14 Mar 2009 Odometer: 82 Location: staffordshire
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 6:35 am Post subject:
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Never understud this "got to have nice looking welds" thing myself, If they do there job why worry!
Rockwatt, I take it that the front diff will be bolted to the front NS wishbone? if so will it not pull down or push up (depending on the rotation of the input) the front NS on acceleration esepecially with taller tyres? or is it so close to the wishbone pivot point that it will not have any amount of effect, or maybe you will be fitting some kind of torque arm to eliminate it?
Love the out of the box thinking and mostly using off the shelf parts to keep costs down, not just another same old, same old.
Will we see this in Comp Safari?
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 11:04 am Post subject:
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offroad 68 wrote: | Never understud this "got to have nice looking welds" thing myself, If they do there job why worry!
Rockwatt, I take it that the front diff will be bolted to the front NS wishbone? if so will it not pull down or push up (depending on the rotation of the input) the front NS on acceleration esepecially with taller tyres? or is it so close to the wishbone pivot point that it will not have any amount of effect, or maybe you will be fitting some kind of torque arm to eliminate it?
Love the out of the box thinking and mostly using off the shelf parts to keep costs down, not just another same old, same old.
Will we see this in Comp Safari? |
No lee the diff will not be bolted directly to the lower wish bone ! It would cause body roll under acceleration and braking!
It will be on a cantilever pivot arm that will now be controlled by the upper arm very close to the inner pivot. The diff will only pivot about 30% compared to the wish bone so torque reaction will be minimal.
Will it be entered in comp safari's? Maybe!
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
email me for details
Find me on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/RockwattEng |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:40 pm Post subject:
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__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
email me for details
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Toseland Mud Obsessed
Joined: 25 Oct 2011 Odometer: 3209 Location: cardiff
1999 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:35 pm Post subject:
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more fine fabrication..
i take it that is not "soft" (ie rubber or Polyurethane mounted) to minimise movement?
or is it just not required?
__________________________________ I live by 2 sayings:
1. The beatings will continue until morale improves
2. Pain is just Weakness leaving the body..
The feeling you get when you first smash your shaft out, is one you will never forget.. especially if you do it in front of 10 guys. |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 7:49 pm Post subject:
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Toseland wrote: | more fine fabrication..
i take it that is not "soft" (ie rubber or Polyurethane mounted) to minimise movement?
or is it just not required? |
Do you mean in the second pic! They are steel dummy bushes that are there for positioning and welding! They are then replaced with polly.
Poly bushes don't like heat !
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
email me for details
Find me on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/RockwattEng |
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Toseland Mud Obsessed
Joined: 25 Oct 2011 Odometer: 3209 Location: cardiff
1999 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:45 pm Post subject:
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didnt even consider that... but yeah i can see how it would be quite difficult to weld near polyurethane lol
__________________________________ I live by 2 sayings:
1. The beatings will continue until morale improves
2. Pain is just Weakness leaving the body..
The feeling you get when you first smash your shaft out, is one you will never forget.. especially if you do it in front of 10 guys. |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 12:06 pm Post subject:
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After looking at the front suspension it didn't look right to me so I took some measurements and ive dropped a bit of a bol***ck with the trig !
In short the wishbones and front carier are rendered as scrap
And with the amount of hours to put it right I'm afraid there's no way it's going to be done for KOV ! So that's me out
So I've made the decision to take my time and do it right with no corner cutting due to time scale as this is going to be a flagship proto for possibly a new business venture.
Stay tuned as this build will be crammed with detail.
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
email me for details
Find me on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/RockwattEng |
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boss Just got MTs
Joined: 17 Dec 2007 Odometer: 262 Location: norfolk
1995 Land Rover Discovery
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 12:47 pm Post subject:
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rockwatt wrote: | After looking at the front suspension it didn't look right to me so I took some measurements and ive dropped a bit of a bol***ck with the trig !
In short the wishbones and front carier are rendered as scrap
And with the amount of hours to put it right I'm afraid there's no way it's going to be done for KOV ! So that's me out
So I've made the decision to take my time and do it right with no corner cutting due to time scale as this is going to be a flagship proto for possibly a new business venture.
Stay tuned as this build will be crammed with detail. |
sorry to hear that, are they not salvageable atall? hope its sorted easeley for you best of luck to you in your business venture too
__________________________________ BOSSFAB
pm me for tube manipulation
2lb club hammer?......HA! my club hammer is a cut down sledge! |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 1:25 pm Post subject:
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[quote="boss"] rockwatt wrote: |
sorry to hear that, are they not salvageable atall? hope its sorted easeley for you |
It will be quicker just to start again as by the time I've cut all the bearing and bush holders out I could have just turned some new ones ! And they would be a bit distorted after being welded twice.
It's not a big prob but the time scale I had was very tight and now it's impossible unless I take 2 months off work.
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
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arreff77 Articulating
Joined: 03 May 2009 Odometer: 992 Location: porthleven cornwall
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 1:39 pm Post subject:
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rockwatt wrote: |
It's not a big prob but the time scale I had was very tight and now it's impossible unless I take 2 months off work. |
i'm sure work would understand
gutted for ya
__________________________________ welcome to the dark side, we have cookies. |
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parrotveasey81 Mud Obsessed
Joined: 13 Feb 2009 Odometer: 7480 Location: bradford on avon (wiltshire)
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 2:05 pm Post subject:
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as arreff77 said
gutted for ya rich
we have all been there and fully made something only to stand back and look at it and go "dam that dont look right "
after my big last bo bo i now tack it all togeather then when im fully happy with it i then fully weld it
still better to get it right first time than rush it just for kov
__________________________________ http://www.bloodredoffroad.com/
Angry parrot fabrications,check me out on Facebook |
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fourtrak craige Articulating
Joined: 21 Mar 2012 Odometer: 863 Location: oxfordshire
1997 Daihatsu Fourtrak
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 2:17 pm Post subject:
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wow what an amazing build thread, shame about having to start again though. i guess perfection comes with time not haste.
__________________________________ if it ent broke i'll break it
if i can't break it, it must be a fourtrak
for all diahatsu parts give bloodredoffroad.com a call |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 2:40 pm Post subject:
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It's ok guys I'm not gutted ! This build needs to be spot on in every way so no compromises, and like parrot said (better to sort it now before the rest is built round it.
The point of this build for me is to design out as many common problems as possible like flex verses handling and strength verses weight and power to traction and self recovery without adding a ton of winches and batterys.
It's a shame about the kov but there will be others and I want to be properly and 100% prepared with a very competitive vehicle !
So like I said it needs to be and is going to be right with next to no compromises.
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
email me for details
Find me on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/RockwattEng |
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durdzz-suzuki-redtop Mud Obsessed
Joined: 08 Jan 2007 Odometer: 2004 Location: doncaster
1987 Suzuki SJ
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 8:52 pm Post subject:
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rockwatt wrote: | After looking at the front suspension it didn't look right to me so I took some measurements and ive dropped a bit of a bol***ck with the trig !
In short the wishbones and front carier are rendered as scrap
And with the amount of hours to put it right I'm afraid there's no way it's going to be done for KOV ! So that's me out
So I've made the decision to take my time and do it right with no corner cutting due to time scale as this is going to be a flagship proto for possibly a new business venture.
Stay tuned as this build will be crammed with detail. |
"You can do it" take zero instead
__________________________________ custom design work, technical and graphical drawings to your requirements / aluminium dashboards / split charge relays / fabrication / any idea pm for details |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:12 pm Post subject:
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durdzz-suzuki-redtop wrote: |
"You can do it" take zero instead |
Zero would need a new cage ! (not msa spec) and as the cage is integrated it wouldn't be the easy !
And the suspension would need modding for more up travel ! Again not easy
But It did cross my mind
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
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Find me on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/RockwattEng |
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jeepmadmike Mud Obsessed
Joined: 08 May 2005 Odometer: 4573 Location: between 6000+7000 rpm and Devon
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:53 pm Post subject:
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as my dad would always tell me when I screwed up, measure twice cut once!
But I know the feeling when it goes tits up once you've spent hours on a project...
__________________________________ Land Rovers are the root of all evil!
Now i have gone and bought a D4!
one day i might buy a 86" series one like my dad had when i was a boy. |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 7:09 pm Post subject:
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jeepmadmike wrote: | as my dad would always tell me when I screwed up, measure twice cut once!
But I know the feeling when it goes tits up once you've spent hours on a project... |
I measured about 20 times and made once but the problem didn't show till it was in front of me.
**it happens
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
email me for details
Find me on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/RockwattEng |
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Toseland Mud Obsessed
Joined: 25 Oct 2011 Odometer: 3209 Location: cardiff
1999 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:06 pm Post subject:
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Which reminds me.... are you available for a quick phonecall tomorrow rock?
forgot last week.. (vitara transfer box)..
let me know via PM or otherwise..
__________________________________ I live by 2 sayings:
1. The beatings will continue until morale improves
2. Pain is just Weakness leaving the body..
The feeling you get when you first smash your shaft out, is one you will never forget.. especially if you do it in front of 10 guys. |
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Back to top |
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Toseland Mud Obsessed
Joined: 25 Oct 2011 Odometer: 3209 Location: cardiff
1999 Suzuki Vitara
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:12 pm Post subject:
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rockwatt wrote: | It's ok guys I'm not gutted ! This build needs to be spot on in every way so no compromises, and like parrot said (better to sort it now before the rest is built round it.
The point of this build for me is to design out as many common problems as possible like flex verses handling and strength verses weight and power to traction and self recovery without adding a ton of winches and batterys.
It's a shame about the kov but there will be others and I want to be properly and 100% prepared with a very competitive vehicle !
So like I said it needs to be and is going to be right with next to no compromises. |
indeed, this gives you time to measure 20 times more than before.. and then refab if necessary..
might i ask what the ACTUAL problem was with them? (i assume a small systematic calculation error but what effect did it have) if that is, of course you can tell us without giving your secrets away.
__________________________________ I live by 2 sayings:
1. The beatings will continue until morale improves
2. Pain is just Weakness leaving the body..
The feeling you get when you first smash your shaft out, is one you will never forget.. especially if you do it in front of 10 guys. |
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Back to top |
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rockwatt Off-Road Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2007 Odometer: 1542 Location: North lincs
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:29 pm Post subject:
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Toseland wrote: | rockwatt wrote: | It's ok guys I'm not gutted ! This build needs to be spot on in every way so no compromises, and like parrot said (better to sort it now before the rest is built round it.
The point of this build for me is to design out as many common problems as possible like flex verses handling and strength verses weight and power to traction and self recovery without adding a ton of winches and batterys.
It's a shame about the kov but there will be others and I want to be properly and 100% prepared with a very competitive vehicle !
So like I said it needs to be and is going to be right with next to no compromises. |
indeed, this gives you time to measure 20 times more than before.. and then refab if necessary..
might i ask what the ACTUAL problem was with them? (i assume a small
systematic calculation error but what effect did it have) if that is, of course you can tell us without giving your secrets away. |
I could tell you but then I would have to have you killed pmsl
__________________________________ Rocklobster gears / refurb cases /rockbuckets/SU manifolds/dual transfer boxes/ sj tcase to jimny cradles and speedo drives/bespoke machining / any thing made to a drawing.
email me for details
Find me on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/RockwattEng |
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